Presumed Baltic Gull 2cy at Albert Village Lake, Leics, England.

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richard lowe
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Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:05 pm

Presumed Baltic Gull 2cy at Albert Village Lake, Leics, England.

Post by richard lowe » Sat Jul 09, 2016 1:21 pm

This presumed 2cy Baltic Gull was videod at Albert Village Lake, Leicestershire, England on 4th July 2016. The visible primaries (p3 to p10), secondaries and tail all appear to be fresh second-generation feathers. Primaries p1 and p2 are missing. This bird appeared small and slim in comparison to the many Lesser Black-backed Gulls present and appears to tick all the boxes for a 2cy Baltic Gull. However, I would value the forum's opinion just to make sure I haven't overlooked anything significant!
Regards to you all, Richard Lowe, Derbyshire, England.
Attachments
fuscus 2cy AVL 4 7 2016 7.jpg
Small, slim and 'blacker' upperparts in comparison to the many LBB's present
fuscus 2cy AVL 4 7 2016 7.jpg (235.81 KiB) Viewed 1542 times
fuscus 2cy AVL 4 7 2016 5.jpg
Presumed second generation tail shows here.
fuscus 2cy AVL 4 7 2016 5.jpg (157.12 KiB) Viewed 1542 times
fuscus 2cy AVL 4 7 2016 4.jpg
Fresh primaries and secondaries with p1 and p2 missing.
fuscus 2cy AVL 4 7 2016 4.jpg (654.71 KiB) Viewed 1542 times
fuscus 2cy AVL 4 7 2016 3.jpg
Another pic showing fresh flight feathers.
fuscus 2cy AVL 4 7 2016 3.jpg (656.99 KiB) Viewed 1542 times

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marsmuusse
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Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2009 12:43 pm

Re: Presumed Baltic Gull 2cy at Albert Village Lake, Leics, England.

Post by marsmuusse » Tue Aug 16, 2016 8:35 am

Hi Richard,
Although an interesting bird, to me it doesn't recall 2CY fuscus. In general it looks rather 'pied' due to the many pale edges and bleached notches of old feathers in combination with adjacent plain grey feathers. Classic 2CY fuscus in July normally show an overall brown to blackish plumage without lot of contrast, like
http://www.israel.gull-research.org/fus ... 41088.html

Here is an example bird that was called 'Barred Barry' in SW Finland when we (Visa, Hannu and myself) photographed it, but even in such birds with barred greater coverts you will not see such a pied impression:
http://www.israel.gull-research.org/fus ... yjul02.htm

For scoring birds, one may create a spectrum of feather patterns from plain feathers to very contrasting feathers. Even in Finland you'll find birds scoring 'contrasting', like http://www.israel.gull-research.org/fus ... yjul22.htm This bird had new blackish feathers growing in, but even by doing so, I wonder if such birds will even make it to the Dutch list and accepted as 'fuscus', for it has a slow moult in primaries and just the presence of the blackish feathers may not be enough to rule out 2CY intermedius.

Back to your bird. I keep on asking myself why I think it is in fact a 3CY bird, still with pretty neat remiges?
Is it because in the first image the iris seems to be pale bluish and not dark? Or was that iris dark in the field (as would be much better for 2CY birds)?

richard lowe
Posts: 16
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:05 pm

Re: Presumed Baltic Gull 2cy at Albert Village Lake, Leics, England.

Post by richard lowe » Wed Aug 17, 2016 9:53 am

Thank you Mars for your thorough response. The iris was indeed pale and I can see now that this is probably more likely to be a 3cy intermedius, as you suggest.
The 'pied' appearance was worrying me at first but there are pics of similar birds on the web, albeit maybe not 'typical' for fuscus in July. It was the fresh-looking primaries that drew my attention to the bird initially - it is clear to me now that much better views or good quality images are required to correctly determine feather generation. I shall be more cautious next time!
Kind regards to you all, Richard Lowe. (Derbyshire, England.)

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