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November 23rd
Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 11:32 am
by Cristian Mihai
Re: November 23rd
Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 1:20 pm
by adriaens
Hi Cristian,
surely this is a cachinnans ? Note, e.g., distinct mirror on P10.
Re: November 23rd
Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 1:34 pm
by Cristian Mihai
Hi adriaens,
In my humble opinion,the one from your quote looks pretty good for a michahellis. But what do you think about this one:
http://www.birdforum.net/attachment.php ... 1290519370
Here we have a relative large white mirror on P10. Also note the white base of the tail.
Re: November 23rd
Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 4:57 pm
by lou bertalan
Cristian Mihai wrote:Hi adriaens,
In my humble opinion,the one from your quote looks pretty good for a michahellis. But what do you think about this one:
http://www.birdforum.net/attachment.php ... 1290519370
Here we have a relative large white mirror on P10. Also note the white base of the tail.
hi cristian,
both birds:
http://www.birdforum.net/attachment.php ... 1290519357 and
http://www.birdforum.net/attachment.php ... 1290519370 are 2cy cachinnans (it was these 2 that i reffered to on BF 'gulls' when saying that i love 2cy cachs). some 2cy cachs lack a p10 mirror as you know and in some the mirror appears like a "ghost" like in the one you thought was a micha.
http://www.birdforum.net/attachment.php ... 1290520279 = 3rd cycle (3cy) micha
http://www.birdforum.net/attachment.php ... 1290527570 = ad micha with large mirrors (note especially all white p10 tip, lack of any subterminal mark)
http://www.birdforum.net/attachment.php ... 1290528012 = ad cachi
best wishes,
lou
Re: November 23rd
Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 6:25 pm
by Cristian Mihai
Thanx for comments, Lou. I also have some (not so good quality!) pics with another adult cachinanns.
Re: November 23rd
Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 7:42 pm
by adriaens
Indeed Lou, although I am not entirely sure of this "
ad micha with large mirrors":
The less than vivid colour of the bill, with rather pale and restricted gonys spot, as well as the slight brownish mottling on the neck and lack of dark streaking around the eye, all make me doubt if this is not more likely a Herring Gull. Eastern birds can certainly show a primary pattern like that (sometimes combined with yellow legs).
Re: November 23rd
Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 10:58 pm
by lou bertalan
hi peter,
i don't exactly know to which extent we can call russian birds herring gulls (considering some of gregs pics from ivanovo oblast - e.g. this one
http://www.flickr.com/photos/neubauerg/ ... 508214870/) but just on terms of likelyness i'd find it easier to find such a YLG in bucharest than an adult argentatus with yellow legs, very little basic plum. head streaking
and black reaching down to p4! orbital seems to be red too (i know eastern HG can have red orbitals and little head striation, some finnish HG cause headaches). bill seems not too pale for a basic micha and many adult basic YLG have a black bill mark like this one. admittedly it's hard to exclude such an argentatus but i still have no pic of any clear HG from romania...
and who says it doesn't have some cach genes?
i'd be interested in its underwing...
lou
Re: November 23rd
Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 9:38 am
by Cristian Mihai
Re: November 23rd
Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 11:02 am
by lou bertalan
yes, it absolutely looks like the discussed bird. and turned into a caspian gull
i think shape of bill, rel. strong yellow legs together with totally hidden upperwing grey tongues made me instantly feel it's a micha
shows how important it is to have a set of pics of one bird in different positions and angles. though one still could make a case for a presumed hybrid origin (F2 maybe) with micha genes - exactly because of the discussed features (bare parts colour, bill shape, iris, some pencil streaks around eye, not so long white underwing p10 tongue).
thanks for searching in your pics and posting them!
edit: actually i have some pics from you with birds which i think are michas but they have similarly long (about half visible p10 or slightly longer) and rectangular tongues. like e.g. this:
lou
Re: November 23rd
Posted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 9:19 pm
by Theo Muusse
Cristian Mihai wrote:Hi adriaens,
In my humble opinion,the one from your quote looks pretty good for a michahellis. But what do you think about this one:
http://www.birdforum.net/attachment.php ... 1290519370
Here we have a relative large white mirror on P10. Also note the white base of the tail.
With such a bill, inner primaries and dark scaps, it must be a michahellis.
Its not the first one I sse with a mirror.
The other 2cy is a cach.
Theo