smith lookalikes

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marsmuusse
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smith lookalikes

Post by marsmuusse » Sun Sep 27, 2009 7:59 pm

Frode's site from Norway shows several dark Herrings:

http://cyberbirding.uib.no/gull/ind_ufo.php (naar midden pagina scrollen)

with some nice candidates, like this one:

http://cyberbirding.uib.no/gull/ufo/1w_01.php

Image

Although upper- and undertail coverts not perfect and rectrices with pale bases...
Mars
Last edited by marsmuusse on Mon Sep 28, 2009 6:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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marsmuusse
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Re: smith lookalikes

Post by marsmuusse » Mon Sep 28, 2009 7:53 am

Right after returning from Scotland, we discussed a bird from Peterburgh. Repeated here: ...

Chris Gibbins wrote:
Hi gents. Following a couple of dark birds seen during IGM, we have been discussing ‘poor-man’s smithsonianus’ So, here is a bird that I had 3 weeks ago at Peterhead but because of being busy with IGM I have only just got around to downloading images. It is another nice example of how dark some of our birds up here can be; on the ground it was not too impressive (body not particularly dark or smoothly textured), but wow what a rump and tail. Unfortunately these are best pics of it that I got.

Pictures Chris (2x flying):
dark HG3.JPG
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Hannu wrote:
Hi all,

Also more or less odd dark 2nd winter birds with tendency to have broad tail band. Here a few birds:

http://www.elisanet.fi/hj.koskinen/2ndW ... tland.html

Martin Reid sent a link to Visa about another dark 2nd-winter photographed at Peterhead on Sunday after IGM. Probably more discussion shall follow...

& Ruud wrote:
Hallo all,

here's a different 2cy we saw in Fraserburgh (27-02) that we dismissed on the basis of too pale undertail coverts and obviously barred greater coverts but otherwise... Would be interesting to learn from Martin Reid if such birds would stand out in Texas.

Hannu maybe it's an idea to compile these and Chris's images on your website?

Cheers
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pim wolf
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Re: smith lookalikes

Post by pim wolf » Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:04 pm

http://www.artsobservasjoner.no/artport ... eID=105294

and another one from Norway. Not the best of candidates IMHO. There surely is something wrong with the pigments in the Herring Gull? Apart from a quite dark plumage is see no charaqcters supporting an ID as smithsonianus.

pim wolf

adriaens
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Re: smith lookalikes

Post by adriaens » Mon Oct 12, 2009 6:54 pm

pim wolf wrote:http://www.artsobservasjoner.no/artport ... eID=105294

and another one from Norway. Not the best of candidates IMHO. There surely is something wrong with the pigments in the Herring Gull? Apart from a quite dark plumage is see no charaqcters supporting an ID as smithsonianus.

pim wolf
The uniformly dark outer webs of the inner primaries are certainly at odds with smithsonianus. Also, the wingcoverts are rarely (if ever) as uniformly dark right up to the top of each feather.
In fact, I even doubt that this is a "herring gull". The white rump, dark inner primaries, small, rounded head and short bill make me think this is a rather dark Lesser Black-backed Gull !

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pim wolf
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Re: smith lookalikes

Post by pim wolf » Mon Oct 12, 2009 10:28 pm

Hi all,

Peter's idea that it could be a LBBG crossed my mind as well but the short projection of the wings beyond the tail (although the angle is awkward) suggests Herring. Also, in a gull this dark I don't know if I can trust the pigments on the inner primaries. Looks like a slender bird though so I'm not betting on either. I am betting that it's not a smicker though!

pim

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Theo Muusse
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Re: smith lookalikes

Post by Theo Muusse » Wed Oct 14, 2009 8:06 pm

A 2cy seen here in Holland at the end of September/ early October...

Theo
Attachments
tatus2cy7054pim.jpg
Tail all dark
tatus2cy7054pim.jpg (207.69KiB)Viewed 9599 times

Ruud Altenburg
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Re: smith lookalikes

Post by Ruud Altenburg » Thu Oct 15, 2009 7:50 am

http://www.birdpix.nl/album_page.php?pi ... ent=0&db=0

This is a Herring but not an American IMO. Upper- and undertail coverts of coure are fine, but the tail is slightly off (a lot of white on the outer web of R6) and especially the underparts seem too blotchy. This in combination with the lack of Glaucous Gull-like structure makes me think it's a bird comparable to these IJmuiden juveniles:

http://forum.waarneming.nl/smf/index.php?topic=91853.0

adriaens
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Re: smith lookalikes

Post by adriaens » Thu Oct 15, 2009 9:53 am

Theo Muusse wrote:A 2cy seen here in Holland at the end of September/ early October...

Theo
Any more pics of this bird ? Flightshots ?
I'm puzzled by birds like this.
Were the new scapulars pale grey or dark grey ?

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pim wolf
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Re: smith lookalikes

Post by pim wolf » Thu Oct 15, 2009 10:16 pm

adriaens wrote:[
Any more pics of this bird ? Flightshots ?
I'm puzzled by birds like this.
Were the new scapulars pale grey or dark grey ?

Hi Peter & all,

I'm puzzled as well and yes, there are shots of the open wings and tail. Both pics taken by me at Westkapelle on 2 October 2009.

Image
Image

Birds like this (dark 2cy) have turned up at Westkapelle for many years now, I've been boring Mars, Ruud and Theo almost to tears with them. General concensus is that this is the darkest variant of argenteus. Mind you, we've never seen or photographed one with a ring. Apart from the dark tail and very dark greater coverts there is one thing that all these birds have in common; the fresh grey scaps are always slightly darker than "standard" argenteus and also much more bluish-grey.

pim

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