2cy cachinnans ?

[RSNaarhus]

Hi

I photographed this 1st cycle gull on the 19th of May at Hvide Sande on the danish west coast.

To me it looks like a Caspian Gull but the dark underwings seems odd. The pattern on the scapulars do not fit michahellis I think.

Also it might be an argentatus x cachinnans?

Best wishes, Rune

[RSNaarhus]

Really, noboby has any opinions on this bird?

Hans Larsson apparantly thinks this bird best fits michahellis, but I still think the scapulars look worong for this species....

Any thoughts?

Best wishes, Rune

[lou bertalan]

Hi Rune,

I'd share Lars' opinion about this bird: it looks so good, structurally for a micha, that it has to be one: an odd one with cachi scaps!

best whishes from Gotland,

Lou

[RSNaarhus]

Hi Lou

I have been waiting to hear your opinion. It is greatly aprreciated.

If you say the pattern on the scapulars fits within the variation of michahellis then I will rest at ease and accept this as such.

By the way: Have you seen this scap-pattern on michahellis previously?

Also as I mentioned initially the underwing coverts would be very deviant for a cachinnans.

Best wishes, Rune

[lou bertalan]

yes, I have seen it in micha although only once. such birds are difficult and a lot of other features should be checked. rectrices seem to be all 2nd gen., right?

[Theo Muusse]

It looks like the inner primaries in at least the right wing appear to be 2nd generation.
Together with the dark underwing, why not a lbbg type?

Theo

[RSNaarhus]

Lou, I don't know if they are (i.e. 2. gen retrices). I had not given this any thought to be honest.

I only saw the bird very briefly through my bins before it flew of.

Theo, what kind of LBBG are you considering. I really do not see this being an intermedius or graellsii let alone a fuscus. The scaps could fit heuglini but from what I know of this form it most often shows paler underwings in this age - am I right? Also heuglini have never been officially recorded in Denmark...

Best wishes, Rune

[Theo Muusse]

Well, I name what I see...
Heuglini is an option, since you call it a dark cachinnans.

Theo

[lou bertalan]

actually, having a look at it again on the big PC screen - can't really stick to my initial statement that it is a YLG...it looks too much cachi-like on plumage and there would be the chance of an oddie with dark underwing and short bill - maybe influenced by tatus genes...

lou

[RSNaarhus]

Thanks for the answers.

I think this bird is best left uidentified.

To my eyes it most probably at least have some genes from cachinnans in it.

Best wishes, Rune